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RED PRO Blog

thoughts from professionals
Tags >> Lenses

Matt Uhry's Lens Fetish - May 16 2009

Posted by:

Tagged in: RED , PRO BLOG , Matt Uhry , Lenses

1. Red Prime Demo. ( only 35mm )

Ted ( from Red ) started out with a discussion about some of Red's lens program's history and talked about how they thought the Red prime was in league with the best cine lenses, yet at a fraction of the cost.

There was a short demo comparing the Red 18-50 and the Red 35mm lens visually on a camera. Both lenses looked fine on the monitor, as one would expect - both being able to make a nice 720p image.

 

 

Then we were allowed a little bit of hands on with the Red Prime - build quality looked to be very good. The size and weight of this lens are not fully apparent when you see the pictures - It's a bit bigger and heavier than Ultraprimes or Cooke S4's. Size and weight wise made me think of the Cooke 15-40 T2. The 35mm was made with an internal floating focus element, a design which I believe should bring really good close focus performance.

Then there was a few minutes of unguided playtime with the lens. It looked to be very high resolution, mechanically excellent very good flare resistance, low distortion, moderate breathing, basically everything looked really good. If the 35mm is a good indication of the rest of the lenses and you are looking to buy a PL prime set: it's a no-brainer.

2. Jacek from Optitek had his Pro Nikon mount on display. It uses a locking ring driven system to pull the lens snug to the mount. The Iris on G series lenses can be adjusted with a simple external ring. He had a Nikon 14-24 on it and it worked well. It's a vast improvement on the stock camera mount - highly recommended if you are shooting with Nikons.

3. Jacek also had the prototype of the Optimator a flange focal depth checking device for the Red and other PL mount cameras. It works by projecting a focus pattern onto the cameras cmos sensor. You rack the mount's adjustment ring back and forth until you can see the highest number on the scale. It's a bit better in theory than the IBE Null Lens because you can use it anywhere - you don't need an infinity target, it gives a readable numeric scale to judge your accuracy, and the Optimator has a provision to see the sides of the frame also which lets you know that your mount / sensor are not askew in some other way. It's self powered with an internal battery or by a cable.

I want to have a look at Uniq optics Diascope and see what's up with that. Probably next week.


Review NAB PL Lenses 2009

Posted by: Finner

Tagged in: PRO BLOG , NAB 2009 , Lenses , FKB Reviews , Finner

NAB 2009 seemed to be hot with 2 main things. 1- PL lenses. 2- 3D everything.

As far as lenses go I was very impressed.

PRIMES

Red’s new primes WOW! Okay these things are SHARP! These could very well be the sharpest cine lenses available. Also the RPP have very nicely built housings and from what I found the overall mechanics were

solid and well built. The coatings looked good and it was very hard to flare them. At T-1.8 they are fast enough for most any shoot. To be picky the issues I found with the RPP were that the focus was a little stiff and could use a lighter grease (In cold weather lenses get stiffer and the current RPP’s I played with would cause problems for remote follow focus motors when it gets cold), T-stop was light and would be better if it was stiffer (After you set the stop you don’t want it to change from being bumped and I found it to spin a little to freely for my liking), the lenses themselves were a little bit heavy (Although not really any different then Master or Ultra primes so they are in really good company), on the projector I could see that the 25mm rounded (fish eyed) a tiny little amount (not anything of consequence but more then MP’s or S4’s hopefully the RPP 18mm does not round more), an 18mm lens is needed ASAP,  it would me nice if both feet/meter markings were put on the RPP lenses like other high end lenses rather then having to choose one or the other. All this said the RPP look very promising and may just be the set that puts Red up in the same echelon with other highly priced/respected lens companies. After looking closely at the lens coatings I wonder if Jim has built a cozy relationship with Nikon (for our sakes lets hope that is the case). The 5 lens set (25mm, 35mm, 50mm, 85mm, 100mm) sells for$19,000 US.

 


 I've Just had the chance to compare the new Red 18-85 and my Cooke 18-100, the short story is Red's new lens is really good and if you are looking for something in that range you should buy it. It's, the optics are great, it's really well made and represents an incredible value.

 

 


I've Just had the chance to compare the new Red 18-85 and my Cooke 18-100, theshort story is Red's new lens is really good and if you are looking for something in that range you should buy it. It's, the optics are great, it's really well made and represents an incredible value. Our test took place at VR in Santa Ana, CA Brad Hagen had 2 new 18-85's and we had a look at one of them in his conference room. Brian Ferguson from Red stopped by towards the end to say hello. MJ Kerber, my friend, colleague and kick ass DP came along to offer a second set of eyes and to help out.

Physical Package:
The lens is all metal, presumably aluminum alloy, it's got a nice finish on it that's matte black. The lens is fat and stubby, I did not weigh it but it's a few pounds lighter than the cooke 18-100.
Over the front element there is a mask with a rectangular cut out. The cut out may be a bit aggressive if you were to use this lens on a 4perf super 35 setup. I had no way to test this for certain, but it looks like you could remove it if you wanted to. Likewise if you mounted the lens 90deg off rotation you might experience a performance drop. No Problems here. The front filter thread is 138mm. This is unfortunate because, cinematographers use 138mm filters, but they are drop in and NOT screw in. The retainer rings and sunshades for this system are a slightly larger diameter. It seems like an easily avoidable mistake the designers could have prevented if he/she had bothered to check what a 138mm filter actually is. You could screw in an adapter, but it could not live full time on the camera unless you got a new front cap. The lens has slick built in .08 module gears, the front focus gear part was so fat it did not work with our chroisziel follow focus, but I think it will work for most using a studio style follow focus. When our 18-85 lens arrives we'll probably modify the support for the follow focus to make it work.
The focus ring was slightly over dampened for my taste, but it's not a problem, I wonder how it will be in cold conditions, not that I have to worry about that in Southern California. Zoom ring and Iris felt great. Not sure how many blades there were on the iris, but it was nice and round and linear.
There is no built in provision for a support and very little real estate ( on level, non rotating parts ) to use a clamp on one. I'm sure we'll be able to get a support on there somehow, but it seems like the designer did not anticipate that anyone would want to use one. It would be great if in the future they included 2 tapped holes like the ones on the cooke so a support could be bolted on.
The rear mount area looks good, back element is adequately protected.. Mount appears to be stainless steel.
Visual Tests:

On the camera the lens FFD and focus scale were set correctly at the factory, It appeared to actually be "perfect" in total agreement with our Cooke which was recently serviced. Nice going Red ! Zoom tracking was off a little, but our camera's mount / sensor is not aligned correctly so that's to be expected. A good way to view these comparisons is to open them in different tabs in your browser and toggle back and forth. All tests were done WFO - 2.9 on the red and 3.0 on the cooke.
Breathing: Very minimal at 18mm, increases a little at longer focal lengths. Here's a clip comparing it to the cooke 18-100 @50mm The rack is from 10ft to 4ft to Inf. and back to 10ft.
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red_rack50mm.mov
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke_rack50mm.mov
Center Resolution
In these cases we went for best for best focus on the putora chart, using a panasonic 17" HDSDI monitor and image magnify mode. Chart distance was 10ft.
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red18mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke18mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red32mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke32mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red50mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke50mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red85mm.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke85mm.jpg
Edge Resolution / Distortion:
We focused on the chart in the center of the wall and then moved it to the corner. Shots were at 18mm, distance 12ft. It's also a chance to see the mild barrel distortion both lenses have. The Red has a bit more resolution than the Cooke in the corner. 18mm on the Cooke is a bit wider than 18mm on the Red.
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red-edge.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke-edge.jpg

Field Illumination and overall Color tone:

This white projection screen lit within .02 of a stop edge to edge with a 4 bank 5600 kino. directly over the camera. The Red lens has much more even field illumination than the Cooke and a cooler rendering of color tones
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red-field-illum.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke-field-illum.jpg
Bokeh Looks like the Red uses some aspherics to get the even field illumination and good edge resolution, the price is some funky donut shaped bokeh.
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red-bokeh.jpg
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke-bokeh.jpg

Flare:

Test of flare resistance and character using a led flashlight. http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/red_flare.mov
http://mattuhry.com/18to85test/cooke_flare.mov
Conclusion:
Red's first pro lens effort is a great success, it's a serious lens that can compete side by side with much more expensive lenses from cooke and angenieux, but at 20% of the cost. It's shortcomings are minor, but annoying none the less, the front filter thread and the lack of preparedness for a lens support. Both are fairly easily solved by aftermarket accessories, but also could have been avoided by a few clicks of the mouse while it was being designed. Thanks for Reading,
Matt Uhry
www.mattuhry.com

 


 

 PL Mount 11-16mm f2.8 Prototype, Manual Iris

 

 


The Good News:
The lens is well built, holds focus


Dan Dumouchel on Twitter

  • Tip: shoot parallel. Convergeance is not the holy grail everyone thinks it is. Pixar=parallel #s3D (via @deathmike) - 23 minutes ago - View »
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